The downside of summer ending: Saying goodbye to those lazy, White Claw-filled rooftop evenings. The upside: Everything is new, from food TV shows to cookbooks to restaurants. And as all that newness hits, trends emerge. Taking a close look at the most anticipated restaurant openings from coast to coast, Eater restaurant editor Hillary Dixler Canavan has identified a few noteworthy patterns:
The fall of the power duo
In Los Angeles, there’s Onda, the buzzy collaboration from Sqirl’s Jessica Koslow and Gabriela Cámara of Mexico City’s Contramar. Farther up the California coast in Oakland, Blake Cole and Kimberley Roselle have tapped chef Christa Chase of Tartine Manufactory to head up the food program at their bar Friends and Family, also opening this fall.
America’s still fixated on French cuisine.
French food has been hot for a while now, and 2019 openings indicate it’s going to stay that way. Walter and Margarita Manzke of LA’s beloved Republique are opening Bicyclette; Dialogue chef Dave Beran will introduce Pasjoli, also in LA; Lee Hanson and Riad Nasr of New York’s Frenchette are putting their spin on French classics at the historic Le Veau d’Or.
Big-time chefs are branching out and getting more casual.
In what’s becoming an increasingly common move, established chefs are opening restaurants that are more casual (or yes, fast casual) than their firsts. Of note is Bonnie and Israel Morales, of Portland’s Kachka, who are finally opening their casual spin-off, called Lavka, featuring counter-service dining and Eastern European pantry staples and frozen Kachka pelmeni.
Dixler Canavan, along with pop culture editor Greg Morabito and managing editor Ellie Krupnick, joined Editor-in-Chief Amanda Kludt on Eater’s Digest to talk about the season’s buzziest trends.
Check out all our Fall Previews here, and listen and subscribe to Eater’s Digest on Apple Podcasts.
Below, a lightly edited transcript of our interviews with Greg Morabito, Ellie Krupnick, and Hillary Dixler Canavan.
Amanda Kludt: But now with fall around the corner, it’s time to look ahead to what we can expect for the rest of 2019. We’re going to talk to the Eater team about all things cookbooks, restaurants, and TV shows. So, now on the show we are inviting Greg Morabito, our pop-culture expert, to talk about the best shows we should be looking forward to this fall. Hi, Greg.
Greg Morabito: Hey, Amanda. How’s it going?
Amanda: It’s going really well. I know there are a bunch here, but can we just start with this Jeff Goldblum show?
Greg: Yeah. It’s interesting. I actually think that this is one of the most anticipated TV shows of the fall, not just for the food space but just in general.
Amanda: Can you explain what it is?
Greg: Yeah, it’s called The World According to Jeff Goldblum and it’s basically a docuseries where he is going to be exploring one of his interests in each episode. And he’s this worldly, suave, weirdo, jazz-playing 70-whatever-year-old actor. He has all these unusual interests, but some of them have to do with food. There’re going to be episodes about coffee, ice cream, and Korean barbecue. He’s really just, I think, going to be a great TV host. And someone like, if you’ve ever heard an interview with him, his mind just shoots off in a million different directions every minute. But he’s still somehow very focused and interested in everything at the same time. I just feel like he’s, like, one of those people like Keanu Reeves too. Everyone’s just remembering or realizing how much they like Jeff Goldblum.
Amanda: He just seems so delightful and off-kilter and fun.
Greg: Yeah. I’m really interested to see how this is going to play out, because it’s one of the new shows that’s going to launch with Disney Plus, which... it’s completely unclear how Disney Plus is going to change the TV landscape. Disney has not had a lot of success with sort of digital ventures in the past. And they’ve been taking their sweet time with this project. The World According to Jeff Goldblum is definitely not the most high-profile project. There’s a Star Wars series. There’s a High School Musical. But, I had this feeling it could be, like, the sleeper hit and just the random thing that people get really excited about that’s included with your $7 a month subscription to this new service. I’ll say that it does seem a little bit odd that why, necessarily, would we be obsessing over this on Eater while there are going to be some episodes devoted to food, but also Jeff Goldblum has a sort of project in the past that suggests that he is actually very good at talking about food, which is why he did a show called Cooking With Jeff Goldblum. It was an online thing where he cooked with Bryce Dallas Howard and the late Jonathan Gold. He is just, like, a very fluid guy in the kitchen, and he seems to know a lot about food, so I think that the food episodes of this new series will definitely be ones to watch.
Amanda: Cool. What else are you looking forward to?
Greg: Well, I’m looking forward to the return of The Chef Show, the Netflix series. I know that people seem a little bit divided on it. I like old-school cooking shows, so it’s basically that with Roy Choi and John Favreau and their celebrity buddies. David Chang is doing a new show for Netflix, kind of a follow up to Ugly Delicious. It’s like a travel show called Breakfast, Lunch & Dinner. Excited about that. But the travel sequences in Ugly Delicious where he goes and eats his way through a city with a celebrity friend, those are some of the best parts of that show, and it sounds like that’s basically what this series is going to be. We don’t know who the celebrities are going to be, but he rolls with some A-listers. If you look at his Instagram feed at all you’ll see that he’s rubbing shoulders with all these famous people now that he has Majordomo in LA and his podcast where he’s interviewing all these famous people. So looking forward to that. Also —
Amanda: It’s so funny ... I just want to stop you because I think that’s interesting that Dave Chang show and Jeff Goldblum and The Chef Show volume two, it’s all focused on this intersection of food and celebrity. There’s this melding of these worlds where it used to be only food nerds really cared about food, but now the celebrities really want in on the action to the point where they want to make a cameo on this, on all of these shows.
Greg: Yes. It’s this unusual thing. I think that there’s just some sort of marker that I think celebrities and famous people have. Maybe they want to launch their own clothing line or maybe they want to launch their own lifestyle brand or they want to have their own wine company or whatever. But I think increasingly, one thing is just something to do with food TV. They want to appear with David Chang. They want to appear with Roy Choi and John Favreau. They want to be in a late-night segment that’s something about food or restaurants. I just think that they’re all up in it right now. That’s great for the people like me, and I think a lot of our readers, who love both restaurants and Hollywood, stuff like that.
Amanda: Yeah, it’s like culture that you want to be up on now. Also, one of the big happenings of this season is Good Eats, the Alton Brown show, is back. It’s back on the air. It’s on YouTube.
Greg: Yeah, it’s back. The first episode’s on YouTube and there are new episodes airing Sunday nights on the Food Network. I think the amazing thing about this is just that it’s a straight reboot. He’s not screwing with the formula. He’s not mixing it up. There’s no new sidekick. There’s not even any new sort of adjustments to the format. It’s just new recipes and he has gotten some new influences because, you know, this is something I don’t think Alton Brown gets enough credit for.
Greg: He’s not just the star of Good Eats. He’s the writer, he’s the filmmaker, he’s the director. He just is. He just is Good Eats. He does everything. Everything’s his vision. He produces it with his own production company. And it’s just kind of like jumping inside this guy’s brain for a half hour. He kind of made allusions to maybe that being the last season of it too.
Amanda: Oh, you think it’s just a one-time thing?
Greg: I think it might be a one-time thing. I interviewed him a few weeks ago and he basically said, “After doing these I can die a happy man, because I feel so strongly about them.”
Greg: So, I think we might be seeing this master of food entertainment maybe taking his final bow here, or maybe he’ll surprise us with some new chapter. I don’t know. But it’s definitely worth catching up on.
Amanda: I would say though, it was nice to see this again, because while he is a great host and has done all those wacky Food Network shows, having him really back in his element is so, it’s just nice. He’s just really, really good at it. And what you loved, potentially growing up or it depending on what age you are, what you loved about that show is exactly the same. It’s still there. He’s still showing off these great kitchen tricks.
Greg: It’s a weird thing where whenever a band reunites after 25 years, you’re like, yeah, well, you know, they don’t look the same. They kind of really don’t have the same get up and go like they used to. It’s like, no, this is not that. This is a complete return to form.
Amanda: But sometimes that happens and then you go and you hear Stevie Nicks and she still kills it and you’re like, you know what, Fleetwood Mac is still awesome.
Greg: Yes. He’s the awesome Fleetwood Mac reunion of TV show hosts.
Amanda: Exactly. Well, thank you so much, Greg. I’m so excited for this TV season.
Greg: Yeah, thank you.
Amanda: Next up we are going to talk about the biggest cookbooks of the season with Ellie Krupnick, our managing editor. Welcome to the show, Ellie.
Ellie Krupnick: Thanks, Amanda.
Amanda: So, first up before we get into the specific books, I heard that cookbook sales are up. Is that true?
Ellie: Yeah, there is particularly some numbers that came out last year that was showing that the sales are up 21 percent year over year currently, which on the one hand is maybe counterintuitive because books — who buys them?
Ellie: Also, there are so many ways to get recipes that are not a book.
Amanda: I always think that. We get so many cookbooks here in the office and I think, “God, is it just completely easy to get a book deal? Are cookbooks just selling like crazy?”
Ellie: Yeah, it would seem that they are. And also I think... I don’t want to say the bar is low. I’m not in publishing. I don’t know. I’ve never tried to publish a cookbook. But there’s everything out there. You’ve got extremely high-end beautiful [books] made for the coffee table. Then if you look — I remember this from Prime Day actually, because there were so many books on sale for Prime Day — there must’ve been 100 books just on keto. There were 100 books just on gluten free, 100 books on paleo. There are so many in so many genres that it seems like it is kind of an endless market.
Amanda: And why aren’t people just getting the recipes online?
Ellie: I think in large part they are. One thing I wrote actually when talking about cookbooks this week in Add to Cart, our [shopping] newsletter, is that I kind of use both, and I think a lot of people do use them for different things. So, when actually walking the aisles of a supermarket, I’m on Pinterest. I’m pulling up an app or newsletter. But when you’re home, you might want to flip through something. There’s some enjoyability to that.
Amanda: There’s a discoverability too when you’re just looking for inspiration.
Ellie: Yeah. It’s way more serendipitous to just flip through this book. And also a lot of them are really beautiful. I don’t think you can underestimate the fact that people want to put them on their shelves in a sort of expository way. Put them on their coffee tables. There is that other element of it that’s less straight service and it’s just more aesthetically pleasing.
Amanda: Yeah, and it signals to someone who’s coming over for dinner party like, “Oh, I also have Jerusalem. Don’t you love this?” Blah, blah, blah.
Ellie: Exactly. Like, “Oh yes, I’m Dining In.” You see it on their shelves and it’s part of an aesthetic, right? You look at covers and it’s no coincidence that a lot of covers look alike — there are trends there, aesthetic trends to the books themselves. And I think that’s a large part of why they’re still selling.
Amanda: So how do we put together this cookbook preview? How many cookbooks do we get? How are we pulling it? How does it work?
Ellie: So, we keep track all year. We have a running spreadsheet where anytime you just see something either on Instagram, a chef being like, “I’ve got a book coming out,” or sometimes a press release comes into your Inbox, we keep a running list all year. As we approach either spring or fall, we start to narrow it down. Sometimes it’s a list of 50 books to start. Also a lot of them are come into our office as samples, which is really fun. And then we really put it out to the team. Everyone is coming from a different place in terms of what they like to cook or who’s on their radar and what kind of cuisine is on their radar. Sometimes the books are really relevant because it’s a really iconic person. So, if you’re a huge Ina fan, her new book is going to be on your radar. Included in this guide is a re-release, essentially, by Fuchsia Dunlop, who’s a very famous name. So, it’s looking at what are the older folks who are coming back or you know are so iconic that no matter when they drop a book you want to know. And then it’s also: What are the new ones on our radar? Who’s someone coming up?
We really put it out to the whole team, because everyone’s got something different on their radar. And then we start to narrow it down, and then from there we actually look at the books. You want to flip through — is this an easy to use book? Is it really beautiful? Are you learning-
Amanda: Do the recipes work?
Ellie: ... Exactly. Are you learning something from it? Is it informative? Or is it tone-deaf? Is it a good book?
Amanda: I love that it’s the whole team because I think if it’s just one person doing it, you don’t get into the weird obsessions of someone. You know like if I was doing it, I might not even think to include Ina because I might think she’s passé but we have people on the team who are just obsessed with everything Ina does and they buy every cookbook she has and they watch every episode of the show. They’re incredibly young. And so it’s cool to have that perspective that there are corners of the universe and big celebrities that people are just very much into.
Ellie: Yeah. And also that everyone’s got their different styles of cooking. Some people really want that very specialized, very technical thing. That’s really exciting to them. One of the books we have on the guide this year is American Sfoglino by Evan Funke. It’s a very in-depth, very technical guide to making pasta. And that’s really enjoyable to a certain kind of reader in some way. And that’s really different than like Antoni from Queer Eye’s book that’s extremely accessible but really fun and really timely.
Amanda: So is Antoni’s book is good?
Ellie: His book is good. It’s fun. Tim Forster, our Eater Montreal editor, reviewed it for this guide. And his good point is that this stuff is accessible, but it also is a little surprising because Antoni is so pigeonholed for being overly simple — like, “Put cheese on a cracker, look, I cook!” — and it’s more than that. There’s actually recipes in there. But it’s fun. Also a lot of pictures of Antoni.
Amanda: Are they revealing photos?
Ellie: I mean nothing more revealing than is on his Instagram.
Amanda: I mean his Instagram is very revealing.
Ellie: He’s wearing shirts in most of these, but not bad to look at.
Amanda: Any other books that are especially exciting on the list?
Ellie: Like I said, I think if you’re someone who’s looking at Fuchsia Dunlop’s Sichuan cuisine book is really worthy of taking a look. It’s sort of a redux of an iconic book that came out 20 years ago, Sichuan Cookery. So, for people who are interested in that food it’s pretty important book. It’s 200 recipes, 50 of them are new. I am personally excited about Sababa. There’s been a lot of Israeli food out there. Obviously Mike Solomonov had the hot book, won all the awards, and also was a follow-up in some ways to Jerusalem, so we’ve had a lot of Israeli cookbooks. [But] I think this one is really good. It’s accessible. Again, it’s kind of a trite word, but it’s just good and interesting and it’s not ... it has your basics. It has your hummus, but it’s not just your basics. That’s by Adeena Sussman. That’s really fun. And she was the co-writer on Chrissy Teigen’s cookbooks.
Amanda: Oh, fun, fun, fun.
Ellie: That’s an exciting one.
Amanda: What about this Questlove book, Mixtape Potluck?
Ellie: I really liked this book. I think there’s obviously going to be skepticism around a celebrity book, right? Do they really know what they’re talking about? Do they actually cook? Is this just going to sell because they’re famous? But one is that Questlove really loves food and he’s really in that world and he’s friends with chefs and really familiar with it. But the cool thing about the book is he’s basically a guide to throwing a dinner party and he brings in all these different recipes.
So, you’ve got recipes from Amy Poehler and Ashley Graham and Zooey Deschanel but also Nina Compton and JJ Johnson and Alton Brown, I think maybe you’ve got recipes from all over the place and it’s just really fun. You’ve got people’s voices in there. He incorporates music into it. The recipes, some of them are pretty simple, some of them are a little more complicated because they’re pulling from real chefs’ libraries. It ends up being a really fun book... and also not to underrate the value of gifting when it comes to a cookbook. It seems like the kind of thing where if I’m putting my gift guide hat on a couple months from now-
Amanda: It’s a good gift.
Ellie: It’s a fun gift.
Amanda: Are there any other common threads on this list that we should call out?
Ellie: Another book that I think is really worthy of note is Jubilee by Tony Tipton-Martin and that one the subtitle is “Two Centuries of African-American Cooking.” We definitely have seen books recently, cookbooks that are talking about black foodways and African-American food culture and that history. You know memorably like Marcus Samuelsson has his Red Rooster book. We have JJ Johnson’s book Between Harlem and Heaven.
Amanda: Well, and her previous book, which was The Jemima Code.
Ellie: Exactly. That’s focusing on a pretty specific experience of black women in the South and their cooking. And so she really is an expert voice on this, so it’s exciting to see another book from her. She’s not only an expert in cooking, she’s a food journalist and she’s really collecting up recipes and history of recipes that are reflecting the African-American experience. So, yes, you have some of the classic soul food recipes that you’re familiar with, but other ones that maybe you are not, like this Caribbean-inspired cuisine that is coming also up in the South and reflects the black experience in America, but maybe not in the ways that a non-black audience would expect.
Amanda: What about the new book from modern day queen of recipes and cookbooks, Alison Roman?
Ellie: So, this book [Nothing Fancy] obviously I think is going to have a lot of eyes on it. Dining In was such a smash hit. I kind of think Alison is a good example to your point before about, why do we need cookbooks where they serve different purposes. Alison, to that point, she puts her recipes everywhere. It’s not hard to get an Alison Roman recipe. You can look on Bon App, you can look in the New York Times. She puts them all on her personal website, Instagram. But the book is obviously a curation. It’s really beautiful. It’s got that very 2019 aesthetic and you know an aesthetic that’s also just been talked about. Right on the cover you’ve got her very clearly painted red nails are visible. That’s very much her thing, right? It’s like, here’s this modern approach to entertaining and cooking.
Hillary Dixler Canavan who reviewed it for this guide, she really loved it. Even if you’re coming in and kind of maybe wanting to not like it or skeptical, she said it’s legitimately good. The whole idea is how do you throw a really accessible dinner party or quote unquote how to entertain in a way that’s not fussy. The word entertaining itself even sounds kind of fussy and old school, but that it’s actually really good for doing some.
Amanda: I love that and I love that cookbooks are still in this world.
Ellie: Yeah, you want something nice to put on your shelf. Again, it’s no small thing but our shelves also are a source for photographs and for sharing who we are and sharing who we are in Instagram and we still want pretty things. Cookbooks are really pretty things.
Amanda: Awesome. Cool. Well, thank you so much for doing all this hard work and for coming on the show. If you all want to read about the cookbooks to get this fall, just go to eater.com and look for our cookbook preview. Thanks Ellie.
Ellie: Thanks Amanda.
Amanda: We have our restaurant editor, Hillary Dixler Canavan coming on. She just published her giant fall preview and we have fall previews for every Eater city across the country. Welcome to the show Hillary.
Amanda: So this is the most exciting opening season of the year as always. What can we expect this fall?
Hillary: There’s a lot of really great openings happening this fall. Some of the things that I noticed that are particularly exciting to me, there’s going to be a lot of really great and really interesting Mexican cooking this fall which I’m super excited about. So, in LA, one of the biggest openings this fall will be this restaurant called Onda, which is a collaboration between Sqirl chef/owner, Jessica Koslow and Chef Gabriela Cámara. And she’s known for Mexico City’s Contramar and she has Cala in San Francisco. This is like a power restaurant pairing, you know? And they’ve spoken about what they’re trying to do together as finding a common language between Los Angeles and Mexico City which they see as sister cities. And I think that is super exciting.
Amanda: Oh, I love both of them too. That’s so exciting. What other new Mexican restaurants are coming up?
Hillary: So, I’m also super excited about this new restaurant opening in Austin called Nixta Taqueria. They’re going to be focusing specifically on corn tortillas. One interesting thing about Austin is that there’s a lot of flour tortillas in Austin so that’s sort of a different approach.
Amanda: That is interesting because if you go to Mexico City or if you go to LA or you know a lot of places there, it’s focused on the corn, but Austin, because of the Tex Mex heritage and also the breakfast taco history it’s more of a flour city.
Hillary: Yeah. And sure, you can get great corn tortillas in Austin. It’s just, I think it’s really unique for a restaurant to be opening and kind of declaring their allegiance to the corn tortilla.
Amanda: Right. I love that.
Hillary: Yeah. And then Ann Kim from Young Joni in Minneapolis is opening a Mexican restaurant and she’s kept the detail’s pretty close to the vest. But Young Joni is an awesome restaurant, so it’s pretty exciting to see what she’s going to do next.
Amanda: Young Joni. Was that pizza?
Hillary: Yeah, it’s pizza and open hearth cooking. Yeah.
Amanda: That’s cool. Yeah. I remember Young Joni when it opened, it got on all the lists. It got on the Eater best new restaurant list. It was in Bon App. It got a lot of attention for Minneapolis.
Hillary: Yeah. And she just won a James Beard Award for best chef Midwest this year, so she’s sort of harnessing that momentum and opening a new place.
Amanda: Cool. And then Enrique Olvera and Daniela Soto-Innes.
Hillary: Yeah. So this is another Los Angeles opening. Atla is looking very good in LA. So they are opening kind of two restaurants in one large space. And again they’re keeping it pretty close but the idea is one will be slightly fancier. So sort of like a cross between a Pujol and a Cosme and then a more casual restaurant, which they had been talking about many months ago as maybe a walk-up taco window but it seems like it will be slightly more than that, but should be pretty casual.
Amanda: Besides Mexican food, any other big trends you’re seeing across the country coming up this fall?
Hillary: Yeah, definitely, I would say one trend that just shows no signs of slowing is America is still very in love with French food and this has been true for a few years. But Lee Hanson and Riad Nasr who opened Frenchette and that was the big restaurant. They’re opening a new restaurant in New York City at the Le Veau d’Or. And they’re going to be doing true French classics and given how exciting Frenchette was, even though it sounded sort of boring on paper, I expect this to be awesome.
Amanda: Yeah. At the end of the day, people just love that kind of fancy French food.
Hillary: Yeah. It feels super luxe and I think in the hands of chefs who are really expert at it, you can really see why these dishes became so foundational to the way so many people cook, you know?
Amanda: Right. Yeah, they can bring it into the modern era too, because a lot of these restaurants, especially Le Veau d’Or, it felt a little dusty and old fashioned.
Hillary: Totally. And there’s nothing old fashioned about Frenchette. It feels really alive. There’s a really good energy in this space. They have this cool natural wine list. So they definitely know how to craft a fun night out for people under 65.
Amanda: Love that.
Hillary: I expect they’ll be able to do that again, yeah.
Amanda: Can you also talk about Bicyclette?
Hillary: Yeah. So this is another exciting Los Angeles opening. It’s Walter and Margarita Manzke from Republique are opening their take on a French bistro. Republique is known in town, especially for its baking, which does lean very French. There’s no reason to expect that this restaurant would be anything less than precise and enjoyable. So yeah, I’m pretty pumped about it.
Amanda: Yeah, I think she makes the best pastries in Los Angeles. She’s just such a star.
Hillary: Yeah, she’s the real deal.
Amanda: Any other trends or anything that you are particularly excited about because you get to travel around the country in the next year to kind of check out what’s new and what’s happening. So what’s on your top three list of what you want to see over the next 12 months?
Hillary: Yeah, so I would say at the top of my list, I’m very excited about this restaurant opening in San Francisco called Dear Inga and it’s sort of going to explore the foods of Georgia and more broadly Eastern Europe. So, I’m looking forward to that. And also I feel like when Kachka opened, I think a lot of us thought that was going to spark sort of a surge in Eastern European restaurants across the country. And it kind of didn’t.
Amanda: Kachka is a restaurant in Portland, a Russian restaurant, right?
Hillary: Yes. And they also are opening a casual spin off this fall too. You know, always with these preview lists you see a lot of second and third restaurants and that’s still the path for a lot of chefs, is open the big one that says who you are and then open the casual one that makes a lot of money.
Amanda: Where people can just relax and maybe have a dish and a glass of wine and move on.
Hillary: Yeah. Or like at the Kachka spin off, which will be called Lavka you can even get their frozen pelmeni to go so it’s the dumplings that are super popular at the restaurant.
Amanda: Oh wow.
Hillary: I know if I lived in Portland I would be doing that all the time.
Amanda: Yeah, no kidding. What about on the wine list or the cocktail list? Anything you’re seeing that’s an interesting trend? Is natural wine here to stay? Are there interesting cocktail movements?
Hillary: Yeah, natural wine is definitely here to stay. It’s increasingly becoming for a certain set of hip, buzzy restaurants, more of a given.
Amanda: Right. It’s like these days you have to have it.
Hillary: You have to have it. It’s what marks you as contemporary and I think what shows that you’re in the know about what cool diners want. And then cocktail-wise, I think it’s a little too soon for me to assess what the broad cocktail trends are. I will say that there is a bar opening that I am very excited about. It’s opening in Oakland and it’s going to be called Friends and Family and it’s by two women, both of whom are established cocktail talent in the Bay Area and they tapped Christa Chase who was the chef of Tartine Manufactory in San Francisco. They tapped her to do the food. So I think it has been a while since we’ve seen a cocktail-oriented bar go hard into food. I feel like that’s been more the territory of wine bars recently so I am excited to check that out and see how that goes.
Amanda: I kind of love this trend of all these women pairing up, these power duos to open something. I know in DC Dos Mamis opened last year or this year. It was Carly Steiner and Anna Bran-Leis and it’s just with the Sqirl/Contramar partnership and what you’re talking about in Oakland, I just kind of love this vibe of power women duos.
Hillary: Yeah, I love it too. And it gives me more faith in the ability for more women who are coming up behind them to get their own places quicker. Because you’re showing that you don’t need like, oh, well we have a male partner to make sure we’re on track.
Amanda: Right, right, right. Totally. I was reading the New York Times preview this morning on the subway and the lead photo was this woman, but behind her there are these two men and it kind of was signaling that. “We have our chef is a woman, but don’t worry, there are these two guys standing right behind her to make sure things are like, okay.”
Hillary: Yeah, we’ve got adults in the room.
Amanda: Yeah, don’t worry, don’t worry. But I love it. It’s just like these super female teams just being like, “We own this.”
Hillary: Yeah, I love it too.
Amanda: Hillary, thank you so much for putting this piece together and for coming on the show.
Hillary: Thanks for having me.